HDC Debates #4: Will Godzilla be the 2nd horror summer blockbuster of all time?

[The Villain]

Originally Posted by neverending

Not so much.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blockbu...tertainment%29

Originally Posted by _____V_____

Same article mentions this as well:

Huh my mistake then. Either way, it won't be as iconic or memorable as say Jaws or other original films because as i said before, it is a remake/reboot.

[MichaelMyers]

Originally Posted by The Villain

Huh my mistake then. Either way, it won't be as iconic or memorable as say Jaws or other original films because as i said before, it is a remake/reboot.

And yet, Villain: recent versions of Little Shop of Horrors, The Fly, The Thing, and Invasion of the Body Snatchers were all "reboots" of original films. And they all surpassed their predecessors. So, too, may Godzilla 2014 surpass its reptilian ancestors along with Jaws.

[The Villain]

Originally Posted by MichaelMyers

And yet, Villain: recent versions of Little Shop of Horrors, The Fly, The Thing, and Invasion of the Body Snatchers were all "reboots" of original films. And they all surpassed their predecessors. So, too, may Godzilla 2014 surpass its reptilian ancestors along with Jaws.

See now that's a matter of opinion. To me, however good the new movies that you stated are, they do not surpass the originals with the exception of maybe The Thing. It stands though that no matter how popular they have become, they wouldn't be there without the originals.

Also the original Godzilla is much more iconic and famous then any of the movies you mentioned. So to say that this new Godzilla may surpass the original, to me is hard to believe.

[MichaelMyers]

Originally Posted by The Villain

See now that's a matter of opinion. To me, however good the new movies that you stated are, they do not surpass the originals with the exception of maybe The Thing. It stands though that no matter how popular they have become, they wouldn't be there without the originals.

Also the original Godzilla is much more iconic and famous then any of the movies you mentioned. So to say that this new Godzilla may surpass the original, to me is hard to believe.

Villain: no question Godzilla 2014 has a long way to go to surpass its original. I just take exception to the notion that horror films can't become iconic or memorable because they are re-makes. The films I listed show that it is not not a disqualifying factor for a horror. Same holds true in other media, such as music (e.g., Johnny Cash covering NIN).

[metternich1815]

Originally Posted by MichaelMyers

And yet, Villain: recent versions of Little Shop of Horrors, The Fly, The Thing, and Invasion of the Body Snatchers were all "reboots" of original films. And they all surpassed their predecessors. So, too, may Godzilla 2014 surpass its reptilian ancestors along with Jaws.

Originally Posted by The Villain

See now that's a matter of opinion. To me, however good the new movies that you stated are, they do not surpass the originals with the exception of maybe The Thing. It stands though that no matter how popular they have become, they wouldn't be there without the originals.

Also the original Godzilla is much more iconic and famous then any of the movies you mentioned. So to say that this new Godzilla may surpass the original, to me is hard to believe.

Originally Posted by MichaelMyers

Villain: no question Godzilla 2014 has a long way to go to surpass its original. I just take exception to the notion that horror films can't become iconic or memorable because they are re-makes. The films I listed show that it is not not a disqualifying factor for a horror. Same holds true in other media, such as music (e.g., Johnny Cash covering NIN).

I agree with MichaelMyers, a remake or reboot is not inherently less than original. There are cases, in my opinion, where the remake was definitely better than the original. Of the examples that MichaelMyers provided, I would agree with David Cronenberg's The Fly and John Carpenter's The Thing. Don't get me wrong, I love The Fly (1958) and The Thing From Another World. They were classics, but they were more along the lines of a 1950s B-Movie. To me, both remakes transcended that and went far beyond that. In fact, I would say both The Fly (1986) and The Thing (1982) are among the greatest horror films ever made. With Invasion of the Body Snatchers (1978) and the 1980s remake of Little Shops of Horror, I believe that the originals were better, though both were solid remakes. As for the Godzilla reboot, I do not think it will surpass the original. The thing with the remakes of The Thing and The Fly was that they did not simply remake the films, they re-imagined the stories and reflected on the concerns of the 1980s. While the 2014 version of Godzilla did re-imagine the story Godzilla, I feel it was less successful at bringing the story to 2014. It kept the original focus of the atomic age. While nuclear concerns still exist in our world today, I think they are at a much lower level than they were in the 1950s. Climate change, the role of technology, and so forth are of much greater concern to modern audiences. I think that the reboot should have kept the spirit of the original, while adjusting it to fit the concerns of 2014. Don't get me wrong, it was a solid film, but it just does not have the markers of transcendence that film like The Fly (1986) or The Thing (1982) possessed. That is the way that I see it.

[metternich1815]

Originally Posted by The Villain

Huh my mistake then. Either way, it won't be as iconic or memorable as say Jaws or other original films because as i said before, it is a remake/reboot.

I did not realize that either. I always thought blockbuster meant a super popular film that earned a great deal of money.

[neverending]

I've said it before, and I'll say it again now- A Godzilla film not made in Japan is an oxymoron.

[The Villain]

Originally Posted by MichaelMyers

Villain: no question Godzilla 2014 has a long way to go to surpass its original. I just take exception to the notion that horror films can't become iconic or memorable because they are re-makes. The films I listed show that it is not not a disqualifying factor for a horror. Same holds true in other media, such as music (e.g., Johnny Cash covering NIN).

Okay maybe can't is a strong word but it's certainly something thats not done easily. The only one i can think of is The Thing but the original Godzilla is much more important and popular and famous then The Thing From Another World and this new Godzilla wasn't good enough to become more iconic then it.

Originally Posted by neverending

I've said it before, and I'll say it again now- A Godzilla film not made in Japan is an oxymoron.

Another reason why this new Godzilla will never and can never surpass the original. Godzilla isn't just a Japanese movie, it's a part of their cultural. It's important to them. It's representative of the biggest disaster and tragedy in their history.

[Sculpt]

Blockbuster...
I grew up in the Jaws age, when 'blockbuster' was first used, and even then, it wasn't well defined in the general population. With Jaws, it carried the 'big hit' definition, which is 'everyone' saw and talked about it, became a cultural icon. Not unlike Psycho and it's shower scene, music and Norman Bates... everyone knew about it, and it became a cultural icon. When a large percent of the populace sees a film, that obviously coincides with large ticket sales.

But as we're approaching some 40 years later, the term 'blockbuster', in popular culture, has come to mean some combo of high ticket sales and the film subject awash in the public media. The new Godzilla film already has high ticket sales and the topic is awash in public media. By general word usage, it's already a blockbuster.


Remakes ever bigger than Original?...
Of course they can, and have been. I was a horror/scifi fan before Snatchers 78, Thing82 and Fly86, and knew the level of weightiness each of those originals had in pop culture. Snatchers was pretty hefty, but Thing and Fly were relatively much smaller, I'd even call the Fly obscure to the general public. Thing82 and Fly86 received a lot more notice than the originals, but I don't think any of the three achieved blockbuster status (Snatchers 78 had most general public notice, the stars helped that).

I agree with Mett that Thing82 and Fly86 were much better films than the originals, and two of the best horror films ever made. (Both Snatchers are good, but the 54 more notable.)


Godzilla And Jaws...
Godzilla2014 is nowhere as good as Jaws. And as Never said, there's nothing new or notable about Godzilla14. Godzilla is every bit a the cultural icon Jaws is, more so, but it's due to 20+ Godzilla films over 60 years, not Godzilla14, nor Gojira54, alone.

[Straker]

Lets not forgot in all of this, that how good it does at the box office shouldn't be a reflection on how good the movie is.... Box office success is just a record of how many hapless souls turned up to watch it, not how good the movie is.