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#41
12-03-2004, 07:40 AM
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Alcohol and weed can be as bad as each other, but what allows them to be bad, is the weakness in humans which allows themself to be consumed by the 'drug' and to push limits to excess.
This debate shouldnt be about which one is chemicaly worse or more chemicaly dangerous than the other, but how people have made these 'drugs' dangerous. Alchohol and weed, both contain natural elements found or grown naturaly in the environment.... hemp and hops. They were not geneticaly produced to create the byproduct, they grew as natural plants. Then along came human intervention, be it Monks, hundreds of years ago, who first discovered the process to make alcohol and its intoxicating effects, and the people who discovered, that burning processed hemp plant leaves would produce intoxicating fumes given off, when the oils in the leaves were heated. It was all about discovery, and how things could be modified and produced, to highten pleasure. It wasnt until the past few years, that these 'drugs' have been taken more seriously by the medical profession. Studies and Lab results have shown that both alcohol and weed contain elements that are beneficial to health. But these benefits, just like the benefits you can receive from all the other health food stuffs, will only be any good, if they are taken in a controlled way. We lack this control in life, and decide to use alcohol and weed or both to feed our own desires for pleasure, and more often than not, this craving for pleasure leads excessive use.... the weakness in ourselves produces the 'danger' in these substances, and not the natural substances in the 'drugs' being dangerous. 
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#42
12-03-2004, 08:11 AM
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Quote:
thats what i was touching on earlier .. the human element .. whatever it is in each particular person that triggers the good or bad response. it applies to anything really ... a hammer is used to create things .. was designed for that. put it in the hands of an idiot and it becomes a weapon. no difference with religion, the written word, or booze and drugs..
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#43
12-03-2004, 08:48 AM
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Or spaghetti.
__________________
Some misguided people decided I was funny enough to pay. See if they're right: http://www.cracked.com/members/Vodstok/ (I tweet pretty hardcore, too)
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#44
12-03-2004, 11:36 AM
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Shanks and urgeok, I see the points that you are trying to make... That too much of anything is not good. It's not good to use anything in excess... And I agree with that, but how can you say weed is as dangerous as beer?
How many people die each year from smoking themselves to death from too much marijuana? How many people die a year from drinking too much alcohol? How many people die each year being hit by a stoned driver? How many people die each year being hit by a drunk driver? And just for the sake of argument, how many people die each year because of smoking cigarettes? Think about it. Marijuana is far and away the least physically harmful to society. That can't really be argued. The absolute worst thing that happens if someone gets too ridiculously high is that they might get the spins and/or puke. A half hour later they are tired, and that's pretty much it. Now think about the worst case scenario for a night out drinking... I mean, come on... How can anyone say with a straight face that weed is just as harmful to society as alcohol (or even cigarettes?)
__________________
Click for bwind22's 1 Minute Movie Reviews!
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#45
12-03-2004, 11:44 AM
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Why not ask the government to legalise it?
__________________
Some misguided people decided I was funny enough to pay. See if they're right: http://www.cracked.com/members/Vodstok/ (I tweet pretty hardcore, too)
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#46
12-03-2004, 11:48 AM
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I don't mess with either, but I think that as a matter of personal liberty, marijuana should be legal.
The history of why certain drugs became illegal in the U.S. is long and tortured. It happened over a period of several decades. There was a time when products containing cocaine and opium were sold over the counter. They were sold as cures for a variety of ailments. During the progressive era of the early 20th century drugs became more regulated, first at the state level, then at the federal level. At first it was more about "truth in advertising" - forcing companies to label the ingredients of their products and that sort of thing. There was a time when you could still these drugs with a doctor's prescription. During the 1910's and 20's various laws effectively outlawed cocaine and opiates(heroin, etc.). Racism against blacks and hispanics played a role in the passage of these laws. And everyone knows about prohibition, of course. Note that alcohol prohibition (1919-1933) in the US required a constitutional amendment. There is no similar constitutional amendment authorizing the government to prohibit drugs like marijuana. It's all justified under the government's power to tax and the power to regulate interstate commerce. The first federal anti-marijuana law was the Marijuana Tax Act passed in 1937. It didn't outlaw marijuana per se, because you could technically possess it if you paid the government a special tax for a permit. But the government simply didn't issue any permits. (I think some clever dealer actually had one issued to him once somehow, but I don't remember the story.) The other authority comes from the interstate commerce power. According to the government, damn near everything affects interstate commerce these days. In the medical marijuana case before the court now one of the issues is: does the government's power to regulate interstate commerce extend to people who grow marijuana for personal use, if the marijuana doesn't move interstate and isn't sold? The government's lawyers argue yes, because the production of marijuana increases demand, and that will lead in interstate commerce in marijuana. Personally I think the prosecutors in this case are full of shit and they should be out locking up terrorists, not sick people.
__________________
Last edited by Kemal; 12-03-2004 at 11:51 AM.
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#47
12-03-2004, 12:01 PM
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Quote:
actually i've been saying from the beginning that the negative social ramifications caused by alcohol is far greater than weed .. I dont smoke it - nor will i (legal or not) but i definately think it should be legal. many people can handle alcohol .. but many people cannot .. and it hurts the community. If weed became legal and widely used we might find out that some people cant handle it but i think that would be by far the minority and the negative aspects wouldnt be the same or as dire as alcoholism. (i may be wrong but i dont think so)
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#48
12-03-2004, 12:04 PM
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Quote:
(i dont know the history and you certainly seem to ...)
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#49
12-03-2004, 07:40 PM
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BWind...You consistantly make good, well thought out points. (glad you're on this side :D )
It's funny, the majority in here seem to be all for legalisation. What's the "average" over in the US...how do the majority view the marijuana thang? As for whoever said alcohol and tobacco being legal was all about the money, I couldn't agree more... I guess the current laws show how harmful and addictive both tobacco and alcohol really are...it must be a pretty bad problem among a lot of people if laws actually protect the sale and consumption of these products, there are SO many issues that simply get overlooked. I simply cannot see how growing and smoking your own could possibly do harm enough to have been outlawed, by comparison to the drugs that are still legally sold despite the various forms of damage they do, or AT ALL for that matter. I'm not saying that I think alcohol should be banned by any means, (although moderation seems to be more of a problem for the drinkers I've known) just that I find it more than a little unfair how unbalanced these laws seem...it's like saying that assault with a deadly weapon is ok, but armed robbery will get your ass grilled. Doesn't make all that much sense to me...
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#50
12-04-2004, 12:15 AM
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You guys seam to be overlooking that actual damaging effects that cannabis / weed has on the body, particularly the lungs and nervous system.
As I said in my other post, about the beneficial effects from both alcohol and weed in small quantities, but these are completly outwayed by the negative and damaging effects when taken everyday or on a regular basis. These Uk medical study results, which I've been searching for on-line, have shown that .....(dont quote me on this)...... smoking a single joint does as much harm to the lungs as smoking 3 or 4 cigarettes in sucession... now tell me that aint damaging. You'll also find that excessive use, which can be smoking just several joints a day, does have long term effects, not only on respiratory, but circulation, and mental health problems. Alcohol will cause most of the above sysmptoms, except lung disease. However, it will take a lot longer and far greater abuse to the body before the physical damage is apparant, i.e. liver sclerosis takes many many years to have effects since the liver and other organs that deal with processing alcohol are far stonger than the Lungs. Lung Disease is one of the biggest killers world wide.... far greater than traffic accidents caused by intoxication through weed or alcohol use. I drink in moderation now, far less than I used to, since going thorugh some rough patches. I also smoked weed pretty much every day a long time ago, and from experience I can tell you the weed affected me mental far greater than alcohol..... take into account though, all people are affected differently, but inevitably face the concequences of abuse.
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