[bloodrayne]

Wow...I have MUCH to answer to :)

Originally posted by bwind22
al-Qaida and the Bathe party hate each other. Saddam and the Bathe Party don't have any ties to bin Laden or al-Qaida

And yet...Saddam had many of his own Bathe party members (mostly officials) executed....Saddam's only REAL loyalty was to HIMSELF.....Do you remember this incident?:

Saddam's daughter had a husband and children....Her husband was an official in the Bathe Party...Her husband decided that Saddam was dangerous and what he was doing was wrong (this was after he gassed over 6,000 of his own people)...He told his wife that he knew his views would get him killed, that he refused to participate in what was going on any longer, so he left the country...He begged his wife to go with him, but she was afraid of what her father would do to her and her children if she tried to leave (she was terrified of her own father...Of course, this was in a country where a father is responsible for cutting off the head of his daughter if she is believed to be 'impure')....Saddam had his sons track down the daughter's husband...The husband was told, "Father wants you to return...Our sister and your children need you...He (Saddam) has forgiven you, he would not harm you, you are family and he knows that his daughter and grandchildren need you"...There was LOTS of convincing and he (the husband) ended up falling for it....As soon as he returned to Iraq, he was beheaded by Saddam's oldest son, in front of his wife and children.....Saddam simply said, "No one betrays me"

It is difficult for us (most of us) to grasp the concept of such brutality and disloyalty.....In a country where you have no loyalty to anyone but yourself, the friend or foe lines are not so clearly drawn...They are VERY blurry, and subject to change on a whim....And so, Although the Bathe Party and Al-Qeida DID truly hate each other, 2 enemies WILL join forces against a common enemy, that is a universal fact (See Army Of Darkness...lol)...And America, particularly our way of life, is hated by almost all of the Middle East...They are raised from birth to believe that we are evil and immoral...

Originally posted by bwind22
The US hired bin Laden during Gulf 1 to try to kill Saddam for us. We even gave al-Qaida the weapons and training to do it. (Hindsight being 20/20 that probably wasn't our best move.)

AND...During Clinton's administration, it was established that Bin Laden was NOT our ally...As we had gathered information that he was responsible for attacks against us BEFORE 9-11...Saudi Arabia had him in custody, they offered him to Clinton 3 times...He was apparently too busy to be bothered with such trivial matters as stopping terrorists...He didn't really see him as a threat...

There have been MANY times that we have tried to help people, provide them weapons and training, and have them turn on us and use it against us....That is not a new occurance, and I am pretty sure that it will continue to happen....We are generally a trusting people, that may be one of our biggest weaknesses (See Mars Attacks :D)

People and situations change...Allies become enemies, and vise-versa...

Originally posted by bwind22
Like you, I also believe the WMDs exist (I think they are probably in Iran or Syria as well.) but we gave the world like 6 weeks notice before going in to Iraq so there was plenty of time for them to be relocated. I'm pretty sure the US government could have seen that coming because I did and I dont have the CIA's access to info.

Have you NO idea how arrogant we are as a country?...We broadcast our intentions all over the world before we do ANYTHING (VERY bad move...But, if we didn't do it, people would scream that they were being 'kept in the dark')....OUR media is one of the enemy's greatest weapons....We feel that we can overcome that breech, we expect them to just wait for us to implement our plans before they do anything...BUT, it's really no different than UN inspectors setting up APPOINTMENTS with them to inspect their weapons cache...Always guaranteeing them the opportunity to 'clean up' before inspectors arrive...Ridiculous

Originally posted by bwind22
al-Qaida is in Iraq now because that's where we are. They weren't there when we went in

Al-Qeida has always been spread out in the Middle East...Although they are actually a relatively small faction (or they WERE until people starting joining them enmasse to 'bring down America')...Yet, they made certain that they remained visible as much as possible in Iran, Iraq, Syria, Saudi Arabia, Afghanistan and even parts of Pakistan...This is a way for a small faction to appear larger than they actually are, as is claiming responsibilty (taking credit) for just about ANY terrorist attack (and even disasters that end up being proven to be accidents) perpetuated anywhere in the world, especially America.....And yes, they did descend upon Iraq in droves as soon as our troops arrived

Originally posted by bwind22
there are no ties between Hussein and al-Qaida in terms of 9-11. (According to the report filed by the 9/11 Commission at least.)

I'm just going to disagree with that...I can DO that, as an American :)

Originally posted by bwind22
Saddam hasn't ever funded al-Qaida. (Why would they even need his money? Bin Laden's got plenty of cash.)

Ever wonder where he GOT all of that money?...It couldn't have all come from his rich family...He had BILLIONS of dollars...Much more than his family's combined net worth...Sadly, some of his money came from US.....But, Saddam was willing to fund ANY faction that was hellbent on the destruction of America...Believe it or not, Saddam doesn't like us very much...heh

And Saddam had ridiculous amounts of money that he diverted from the Oil For Food program that was SUPPOSED to go to his people...The UN was responsible for overseeing that program, and making sure that the funds were distributed as intended, just as they were supposed to handle the weapons inspections...And people wonder why we do NOT have much faith in working with the UN...They have proven to be dangerously ineffective, on far too many occasions

And yes...Bin Laden needed money after his assets were frozen...No, I don't believe it was possible to locate ALL of his resources, BUT we even had a stranglehold on all of the assets of his family members as well...It HAD to restrict him quite a bit...


Your turn:)