I am going to list all the films I am backing, even if I have already backed them I will list them. So, here are the films I am backing:

Onibaba
The Little Shop of Horrors
Blood Feast
Invasion of the Triffids
Viy (I am removing my backing for Hour of the Wolf)
Village of the Damned (I can't believe that only one person has voted for it and no one has backed it. It is an excellent classic from the 1960s)

I do have one question. Are the backings for top 22 and honorable mentions equal? The reason I ask is that the backings for honorable mention are still asterisked.

No, they are not. Backings for spots in the top 22 are indicated by ITALICISED names, while backings for Honorable Mentions are separated within curly brackets {} and marked with an asterisk (*).

metternich1815's choices have been added. Of course, the ones he wanted to be a part of the top 22 stay as italicised under his name. Blood Feast now joins the ranks of Honorable Mentions as our SIXTH chosen one.

http://www.horror.com/forum/showthre...057#post954057

So, do we all agree on these 6 choices for the Honorable Mentions? If yes, we can wrap up the 60s and move into the 70s.

So, just to be clear, if a film has two backings for honorable mention and two regular backings (for top 22), then the second one will carry more weight?

Most definitely.

Okay, that makes sense. I just wanted to make sure.

All in agreement for our SIX honorable mentions for the 60s?
Or do we have any objections/debates/arguments for any/most/all of them?

I approve of the 6.

I would like to have seen Village of the Damned in there, but it is a pretty solid list, in my opinion. I am fine with it.

Me too ...........

I'd like to give just a little time to guage interest in the arguments I made if possible. Based on the criteria I outlined, I'm going to back the following four movies:


Italian/Giallo:
- I'll back Black Sunday (aka The Mask of Satan) (1960), although I'm happy to change my vote to Black Sabbath, Kill Baby Kill, Blood and Black Lace, or any Mario Bava film that anyone is willing to back. IMO, if Bava can't make a list of the 28 most important horror films of the 60s, something is seriously wrong.


The Sixties being a Transitional Period:
- This is an odd choice, and won't get any support, but I'm going to back Django Kill... If You Live, Shoot! (1967). It's a horror/western hybrid that reflects the cultural changes of the time and a general shift towards cynicism in art: Hypocrisy in religion, gay cowboy gangs, suicide, and explicit violence (the scalping scene is epic). Plus, the avenging protagonist is the walking dead, and a generally a bad dude. An anti-hero.

If anyone else gets what I'm saying about this concept, agrees and would like to put forth a different example, I'll consider backing that too. Basically, it's the difference between Help! and Revolver.


Inception of Splatter:
- As mentioned (and already accounted for by V), I'll back Blood Feast (1963), not because it's a great movie (it sucks), but because it has balls, and it opened the door for a whole new element in horror.

I have decided that I will remove my backing for Viy because I do not think anyone will back it. I backed it, so that there would be a little more variety. I will replace that backing with another one. I will back Black Sabbath. Giganticface made a great point. And, now that he says that, it is unbelievable that there are no Bava films on this list, so I decided to back, arguably, his most important film. Sorry, I do not know the film's foreign title.

I'll back Black Sabbath (1963) (aka I tre volti della paura) too. Thanks, Mett.

I think the only reason Bava isn't there is because of V's use of foreign titles. I'm not putting the blame on V, but on lazy bastards like myself who couldn't be bothered with looking up foreign titles, when there were hundreds of other films to consider. I think Black Sunday should be on the list (not only for Bava, but Barbara Steele as well!), but I can't think of any of the 6 chosen to eliminate.

I know you think Karloff/Price/Lorre/Corman/Matheson are overrepresented, but there's a reason if someone says name a horror actor, the majority of the time it's going to be one of those. And it's a better film than some already chosen- such as Masque of the Red Death, or Pit and the Pendulum.

Mr. Sardonicus is certainly one of the top films of Castle's career.

Little Shop is a legend and an icon.

Triffids has been argued for persuasively by several.

Onibaba- I've never seen it, but if we eliminate it, then we lose diversity.

Blood Feast- as has been said, Lewis should be on the list. 2000 Manics is a better film, but this is his most famous.

I guess if Black Sunday was going to be included, I'd recommend eliminating one of the last two. Which should we lose- early Asian horror or a seminal Lewis film?

I'm good with those movies selected

I am happy with the final 6, its unfortunate if Bava misses out, but if he misses out at the expense of, for example, Kanito Shindo (Onibaba, Kuroneko) then that what have we really accomplished? I could've happily backed Onibaba, Kuroneko or Kwaidan, two of which made my original 20. I chose Onibaba because I figured it would get more support and was the best route to get Asian horror represented. Really hope we don't see it drop out at this late stage.

I also want to add that I backed I Vampiri for the 50's, not only was this one of Bava's first directing efforts, it was also the first Italian horror of the sound era. Not the best example of his work, but still a landmark in the genre and Bava's career, featuring both beautiful cinematography from Bava and some quality set design. It received no backing.

Yes... I'm guilty too.

Also some actors were simply in a LOT of movies, especially in the days of "classic horror", and saying that an actor can only be represented X amount of times could mean that several important movies would have to be "banned" from the final list.

You make a compelling case.

I'd rather not lose Onibaba or Blood Feast for what they represent.

I wish we could replace the Quatermass sequel with Triffids, but I suppose it's too late for that.

Little Shop is certainly iconic. Personally, I think we could live without it because it's not _required_ on a horror list... it's horror-themed. If it were that essential, it should have made the initial top 20. But yeah, it's a tough one to lose.

I would vote for dropping The Raven. I know you backed it, and it might be better than some already on the list, but it's not seminal -- it's just another really good film in a genre that's already heavily represented in the list. Ignoring the inception of giallo would be a flaw in our "history."

[edit]:
Also, remember we're talking about Honorable Mentions here. That doesn't have to mean "the next best that didn't make the list." It's a good way to do some clean up on the proper list. We have Asian horror, B-movie/exploitation/splatter-inception, comedy (assuming we keep Little Shop), and giallo if we get Bava in. I once read a top N horror list that had Michael Jackson's Thriller as an Honorable Mention. I thought that was a great idea. You would never in a million years include it in the list of proper "top" movies, but it was a great way to include it in the conversation, and show that it had significance.

I would like to remove one of my backings, if it's ok.

I backed both the Triffids and The Raven - but as much as I love The Raven, I would like to withdraw my backing from it if I can, to improve the chances of The Triffids, which I think deserves the spot more than The Raven - even if they are both excellent movies in their own ways.

I've enjoyed reading your incite in the era, getting some representation of what we might call 'a minor sub-genre', and a nod towards Bava's. Actually, it would be cool to include your write-up below the Honorable Mentions.

My thinking on having diversity, and having a representative film by a director of many films, or rep of a country, or being concerned with having too many films with an actor or actors is: I personally think it's a much higher priority to pick the best films. The single film is king.

If you've ever worked on a film/video/play/recording/etc, you get an appreciation for the 'life of their own' these films take. It comes from the input of so many different people, from personal, accidental & metaphysical means. What actor is in it, the director, country, era elements are secondary -- something to consider -- but secondary. That's just my long considered opinion. I think if a film is good enough, it will earn a spot on it's own merit.

Having said that, I'm OK with the original outcome we came to, and V presented. Which was:

Day of the Triffids (1962)
The Raven (1963)
Onibaba (1964)
The Little Shop of Horrors (1960)
Mr. Sardonicus (1961)
Blood Feast (1963)

As I stated, I think the best films deserve to get in. I think Day of Triffids and The Raven are the best, & too big to leave out.

I don't have an objection to replacing Blood Feast (or Mr Sar/Sho/Oni) if you guys really think Black Sunday is a straight-up better film.

Finally, if we're still in discussion, I actually agree with Metternich, where I think Village of the Damned (1960) is a classic. I'd be in favor of replacing Blood Feast with Village. But again, I'm OK with the list of 6 we have.

Quatermass and the Pit (1967) is in the Top 22. Just checking, did you mean you wish Day of the Triffids would replace Quatermass and the Pit in the Top 22?

That's exactly what he wrote

Oh OK. I agree with that sentiment, Gigan. I think both films are very good. But yes, I know that part is closed. :)

Majority are in favor for the 6 Honorable Mentions, so they are passed and we seal the 60s here.

After reading through the discussion (Giganticface, NE & Straker all make valid points here), and just so that we don't overlook the significance of films which were trend-setters and revolutionary in their respective periods, I have decided to make a SEPARATE SECTION for those films specifically pointed out, like Bava's masterpieces, pulpy classics and early Asian horrors.

That section will be called "HDC Members Specially Recommend", and will contain 40 films selected by HDC members on their merit of significance in the history of horror films alone, from 1897 - 2012. These films will free and separate from segregation of periods/eras, etc., and will solely make into this section for their significance alone.

I will go through the thread from the beginning and check out the debates and see which films made compelling and valid arguments for themselves but lost out in the final race for the top 22 + 6 Honorable Mentions.

Of course, that will be AFTER we are done with all periods of horror.

Now, let's check our final tally for the 60s and move into the 70s...

Excellent idea, V!

You're a genius!

Here's our final tally for the 60s...


IN THE CUT

Psycho (1960) - 10

Night of the Living Dead (1968) - 9
Rosemary's Baby (1968) - 9

The Birds (1963) - 8
The Haunting (1963) - 8

Carnival of Souls (1962) - 7
House of Usher (1960) - 7
Repulsion (1965) - 7
The Masque of the Red Death (1964) - 7

Eyes Without a Face (1960) - 6
Peeping Tom (1960) - 6
The Innocents (1961) - 6
What Ever Happened to Baby Jane? (1962) - 6

Pit and the Pendulum (1961) - 5

Targets (1968) - 4
The Tomb of Ligeia (1964) - 4
Witchfinder General (1968) - 4

Quatermass and the Pit (1967) - 3
Spider Baby or, The Maddest Story Ever Told (1968) - 3

The Cremator (1969) - 2

The Last Man on Earth (1964) - 4 (backed by The Villain, seconded by realdealblues, Kandarian Demon, hammerfan)[IN]
The Brides of Dracula (1960) - 4 (backed by The Villain, seconded by realdealblues, Sculpt, hammerfan)[IN]

--------------------------------------------------------------

HONORABLE MENTIONS

Onibaba (1964) - 3 (backed by Straker, seconded by roshiq) {metternich1815*}
The Little Shop of Horrors (1960) - 3 (backed by neverending, seconded by The Villain, metternich1815)
The Raven (1963) - 3 (backed by neverending, seconded by Kandarian Demon, realdealblues)
Invasion of the Triffids (1962) - 2 (backed by Sculpt, seconded by Kandarian Demon) {metternich1815*}
Mr. Sardonicus (1961) - 2 (backed by neverending, seconded by Straker)
Blood Feast (1963) - 2 {backed by Giganticface*, seconded by metternich1815*}



DEBATABLE

The Curse of the Werewolf (1960) - 3


MINORITY

13 Ghosts (1960) - 2
Dracula has Risen From the Grave (1968) - 2
Frankenstein Must Be Destroyed (1969) - 2
Hour of the Wolf (1968) - 2
Kwaidan (1964) - 2
Mothra vs. Godzilla (1964) - 2 (backed by Sculpt)
Operazione paura (1966) - 2
Paranoiac (1963) - 2 (backed by The Villain)
The Creeping Terror (1964) - 2
The Evil of Frankenstein (1964) - 2
The Gorgon (1964) - 2 (backed by The Villain)
The Haunted Palace (1963) - 2 (backed by Kandarian Demon)
The Terror (1963) - 2


SINGLE VOTES TO

À Meia-Noite Levarei Sua Alma (1964)
Das Testament des Dr. Mabuse (1962)
Dementia 13 (1963)
Destroy All Monsters [1968]
Diary of a Madman (1963)
Ghidorah, the Three-Headed Monster [1964]
Hush...Hush, Sweet Charlotte (1964)
Invasion of Astro-Monster (Godzilla vs. Monster Zero) [1965]
Jesse James Meets Frankenstein's Daughter (1966)
La maschera del demonio (1960)
Mad Monster Party? (1967)
Mothra (1961)
Terrore nello spazio (1965)
Premature Burial (1962)
Tales of Terror (1962)
The Beast of Yucca Flats (1961)
The Boarding School aka La residencia (1969)
The Comedy of Terrors (1963)
The Devil Rides Out (1968)
The Fearless Vampire Killers (1967)
The Kiss of the Vampire (1963)
The Oblong Box (1969)
The Phantom of the Opera (1962)
The Tell-Tale Heart (1960)
Twice-Told Tales (1963)
Village Of The Damned (1960) (backed by metternich1815)
Viy (1967) {backed by metternich1815*}


SPECIAL SECTION - REST OF THE GIANT MONSTER FILMS OF THE 60s :-

All Monsters Attack 1969
Atragon 1963
Bambi Meets Godzilla 1969
Daikyoju- Gappa 1967
Dinosaurus! 1960
Dogora, the Space Monster 1964
Frankenstein Conquers the World 1965
Gamera 1965
Gamera vs. Barugon 1966
Gamera vs. Guiron 1969
Gamera vs. Gyaos 1967
Gamera vs. Viras 1968
Godzilla vs. The Sea Monster 1966
Gorath 1962
Gorgo 1961
King Kong Escapes 1967
King Kong vs Godzilla 1962
Kong Island 1968
Konga 1961
Latitude Zero 1969
One Million Years B.C. 1966
Reptilicus 1961
Son of Godzilla 1967
The Magic Serpent 1966
The Mysterious Island 1961
The Valley of Gwangi 1969
The X from Outer Space 1967
War of the Gargantuas 1966
Yongary, Monster from the Deep 1967


{* = HONORABLE MENTIONS}


We move to the 70s now...

IN THE CUT

Halloween (1978) - 10
The Texas Chain Saw Massacre (1974) - 10

Alien (1979) - 9
Carrie (1976) - 9
Suspiria (1977) - 9

Dawn of the Dead (1978) - 8
Jaws (1975) - 8
The Abominable Dr. Phibes (1971) - 8
The Amityville Horror (1979) - 8
The Exorcist (1973) - 8

Invasion of the Body Snatchers (1978) - 7
Phantasm (1979) - 7

Last House on the Left (1972) - 6
The Omen (1976) - 6
The Wicker Man (1973) - 6
Zombi 2 (1979) - 6

The Hills Have Eyes (1977) - 5

Eraserhead (1977) - 3

Salem's Lot (1979 TV Movie) - 2

Rabid (1977)

Black Christmas (1974) - 3 (backed by neverending, seconded by realdealblues, metternich1815, Kandarian Demon)[IN]

Burnt Offerings (1976) - 2 (backed by hammerfan, seconded by realdealblues, Giganticface, The Villain)[IN]

---------------------------------------------------------

HONORABLE MENTIONS

The Sentinel (1977) - 2 (backed by Straker, seconded by Giganticface, The Villain) {realdealblues*}
Martin (1977) - 2 {Straker*, neverending*, Giganticface*, Sculpt*, The Villain*}
The Night Stalker (1972 TV Movie) - 2 (backed by Sculpt, seconded by realdealblues) {The Villain*, neverending*, Straker}
Frankenstein: The True Story (1973, TV) - 2 (backed by Straker, seconded by neverending) {The Villain*, Kandarian Demon*, metternich1815*}
The Driller Killer (1979) {Neverending*, The Villain*, realdealblues*, Giganticface*, metternich1815*, Kandarian Demon*}
Deep Red (1975) {Giganticface*, realdealblues*, metternich1815*, Kandarian Demon*}




DEBATABLE

The Andromeda Strain (1971) - 3


MINORITY

A Bay of Blood (1971) - 2 (backed by roshiq)
Frogs (1972) - 2
I Spit on Your Grave (1978) - 2
Let's Scare Jessica to Death (1971) - 2
Magic (1978) - 2 (backed by Sculpt) {Giganticface*, The Villain*}
The Brood (1979) - 2 (backed by roshiq) {The Villain*, realdealblues*, Sculpt*} (-1)
The Dunwich Horror (1970) - 2 (backed by hammerfan)
The Legend of Hell House (1973) - 2 (backed by roshiq) {metternich1815*} (-1)



SINGLE VOTES TO

A Virgin Among the Living Dead (1973)
A Warning to the Curious (1972 TV)
Alucarda, la hija de las tinieblas (1977)
Awakening of the Beast (1970)
Blood for Dracula (1974) (backed by roshiq)
Captain Kronos - Vampire Hunter (1974)
Damien: Omen II (1978) (backed by Kandarian Demon)
Daughters of Darkness (1971)
Deliverance (1972)
Don't Be Afraid Of The Dark (1973 TV)
Dr. Phibes Rises Again (1972)
Dracula (1979)
Dracula A.D. 1972 (1972)
Empire of Passion (1978)
Flesh for Frankenstein (1973)
Frightmare (1974)
Ghost Story (1974)
Gojira tai Hedora (1971) (backed by Sculpt)
Grizzly (1976)
House of Dark Shadows (1970)
I Drink Your Blood (1970) (backed by roshiq) {realdealblues*}
It's Alive (1974) {metternich1815*}
King Kong (1976) {Giganticface*} (-2)
Kingdom of the Spiders (1977)
La noche del terror ciego (1972)
Le frisson des vampires (1971)
Madhouse (1974)
Non si sevizia un paperino (1972)
Nosferatu the Vampyre (1979) {metternich1815*, Sculpt*}
Orca (1977)
Soylent Green (1973)
Sssssss (1973)
Straw Dogs (1971) {Giganticface*}
Tales from the Crypt (1974)
Taste the Blood of Dracula (1970)
The Food of the Gods (1976)
The Ghost Galleon (1974)
The Horror of Frankenstein (1970)
The Incredible Melting Man (1977)
The Other (1972)
The Satanic Rites of Dracula (1973)
The Spell (1977 TV Movie)
The Stepford Wives (1976) (backed by metternich1815)
The Tenant (1976)
The Town That Dreaded Sundown (1976)
Theatre of Blood (1973)
Trilogy of Terror (1975 TV Movie)
When a Stranger Calls (1979)
Willard (1971)
Within the Woods (1978 Short Film)
Your Vice Is a Locked Room and Only I Have the Key (1972)


SPECIAL SECTION - REST OF THE GIANT MONSTER FILMS OF THE 70s :-

A*P*E 1976
Daigoro vs. Goliath 1972
Empire of the Ants 1977
Gamera vs. Jiger 1970
Gamera vs. Zigra 1971
Godzilla vs. Gigan 1972
Godzilla vs. Mechagodzilla 1974
Godzilla vs. Megalon 1973
Night of the Lepus 1972
Prophecy 1979
Queen Kong 1976
Space Amoeba 1970
Terror of Mechagodzilla 1975
The Food of the Gods 1976
The Giant Spider Invasion 1975
The Mighty Peking Man 1977


{* = HONORABLE MENTIONS}



The initial backings/negations stay.

Adding a special "Giant Monster" films section at the end for due consideration, since it was demanded.

Remember, we are here to select TWO films from the remaining ones from the DEBATABLE section onwards.
The "In The Cut" section is NOT for debate.

Once that is done, we can proceed to select SIX films from the remaining films for our Honorable Mentions.

OR, if everyone is in joint agreement, we can shortlist the TWO films from the 3-votes section for our Top 22, and get the Honorable Mentions from the rest.

OR we can go the old-fashioned way and debate till we get our chosen films.

Either way, let's hear it.

Good god.... am I the only one left around here who's heard of Abel Ferrara?

Sweet! Great idea, V.

I'm not following. Is that a plea for backings of The Driller Killer? (Love his character in that film... such a spazz.)

Interesting idea V. I'll back Black Christmas and The Stepford Wives for Top 22.

It's a cry of frustrated disbelief. Ever felt that way?

Thanks for the nice compliments about my comments, Sculpt. We're definitely on different sides of the coin on this topic though. We're not making a movie, we're making a list. If I were teaching a class on the history of rock music, and I only had time to go into detail about 10 albums, and I thought 5 of the best albums were by the Beatles so I spend half the semester talking about the Beatles... well that wouldn't be a very good class IMO.

We have a list here at HDC for the top 100 most disturbing and gorrific films. If half that list were from the torture subgenre because those truly were the most disturbing, that wouldn't be a very good list IMO. Instead, the list contains plenty of films that aren't terribly disturbing, but a wide variety of styles and approaches are represented at varying degrees of disturbing. It's a good list.

If I were a visitor who stumbled upon this HDC list called 100 Years of Horror, I would hope that list would give me a solid, thorough overview of all the high points and important points that occurred over the century. That's just me though. Maybe not everyone would expect that. For the most part I think we're doing a decent job of that, but there are a few glaring omissions, and some imbalance, and not just in the 60s.

At any rate, I love V's idea, and I think that solves the problem.

Oh yeah, and Black Sunday is an infinitely better movie than Blood Feast. That's not why I backed Blood Feast.

http://forums.civfanatics.com/images/smilies/wavey.gif

.

Haha, yep! I'm just not following what it's in reference to. Oh well, my mind is typically full of non sequiturs.

I completely understand your points here, but I still think we have made some really good lists, so far, even if they aren't perfect. That is just my opinion though.

I don't disagree. This is going to be a killer final product, and I can't wait to see it in its entirety.

For inclusion in the Final 22 I back, and seek endorsements for this film:

Godzilla Vs The Smog Monster (1971) (Hedora)- A fantastic, innovative and scary film. It's psychedelic, they included animated sequences, amazing set and colors, use of jazz and acid rock, where they mix jazz in with the spoken parts, including rather bizarre things, like the eggs of Monster. It's the first film to attack the issue of pollution, at the same time it's a metaphor for the evil/neglect of mankind.

The horror scenes include a coastal giant sludge tadpole menacing a child's father, and then the child slicing it with his knife. In a nightclub, slug from monster pours down the steps, like the blob (the ending of the scene with the slug covered cat meowing is classic!). The Smog Monster flies over a children camp exercising, releases it's smog on them, and they're left as smoking skeletons (child's film?). The "flower children" teens are partying at night when a GIGANTIC Hedora walks up, even towering over Godzilla (genius). A true period piece.

If you haven't seen Godzilla Vs The Smog Monster, you are missing an artistic film treat! A truly special film. I invite you to toke up, and follow it up with the Yellow Submarine. ;)


Animated sequences like this: http://youtu.be/rVLaqFWpm7A

Also, for the Final 22, I'd also like to support:

The Night Stalker (1972 TV Movie) - A classic, always highly rated, thoroughly enjoyable. Best made for TV I've ever seen, any genre. "An abrasive Las Vegas newspaper reporter investigates a series of murders committed by a vampire." Can see full film on Youtube.com for free http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zAy8v0FMoAM

If I were to support more than 2 films for the 22:

Magic (1978) - fascinating, and unusually scary film about a ventriloquist (Anthony Hopkins) who can't put his dummy down, even for 20 secs... he's insane. Directed by Richard Attenborough. also starring Ann-Margret, and Burgess Meredith.

The Andromeda Strain is a great film, I just don't consider it Horror.

I....need to watch more movies. I haven't seen most of those.

*shamefully hangs head*

If anyone gives some compelling arguments I'll back the films you suggest

See my two posts prior to yours. :)