Do you believe in Jesus?

[crazy raplh]

http://news.aol.com/topnews/articles/_a/scholars-clergy-criticize-jesus/20070226101109990001?ncid=NWS00010000000001

I thought this was rather intresting. I am always up for anything new and has a diffrent look on things.

[Roderick Usher]

I love this shit. It's such a no-win that it kills me. Those who believe will believe in the face of any data and those who don't believe will cling to anything that supposedly backs up their position.

The truth went out the window a long time ago and we'll never find it by digging in the dirt. But I do love the idea and I love stirring shit up. If this shakes someone's faith, then I seriously doubt their faith.

I am 100% on the fence. I want to believe. I was raised to beleive, but I LOVE challenging preconceptions.

[Despare]

I believe in both God and Jesus and watching a movie won't change that. If the film looks good I'll see it, if not I'll skip it. Like Rod said, nobody knows the truth right now. We'll all find out eventually.

[Gus]

you'll believe when the devil has a fork up your ass

[novadawn969]

To believe in someone is to support them expecting results, yes? Then by my own definition, I do not believe in Jesus. I do belive that he was a good guy, and I do believe that if he is really a diety, then go christians! But I am not christian, nor do I see myself becoming one. For those who follow Christ truely do not follow him. His true followers are so few in number, that I believe the true sense of the word 'chrisianity' is dead. People choose to say they follow him, yet by their own words and actions, they contradict themselves. I could go off on this all day, but I have lunch to eat.

[ferretchucker]

I believe Jesus existed and was an extremely mentally advanced man for his time but I don't believe he was sent down by god. Ithink even he believed that himself and the misracles he did weren't the power's of god, but done through his own knowledge. Some things I can't explain and I do believe in magic but I'm still not sure of the existence of god. I think agnostic is the safest way to go, as shown in this video.

http://www.loservillex.com/reaper.html

watch it, it's funny

[DP McCoy]

It doesn't matter if you believe in him,for he believes in you!

http://i167.photobucket.com/albums/u139/dazpier/126jesus983794.jpg

[Unaboner3000]

Jim Cameron makes a documentary about finding the corpse of Jesus....and it pisses off the Church. HAHA!

Does anyone else think Cameron was purposely trying to stir some shit here? :p

[Ash's_evil_hand]

It doesn't matter if you believe in him,for he believes in you!

http://i167.photobucket.com/albums/u139/dazpier/126jesus983794.jpg

Ha ha! Loved that - I got it on a Christmas card once!

For what it's worth, I think there probably was a Jesus who had some great ideas and philosophies, unusual for their time. But I've gotta go with Trippin - miracle worker? Please!

As far as the whole God thing goes, I find it stunningly arrogant that mankind believes itself to be the physical representation of God on Earth. We've been here for a tiny amount of the Earth's history - surely the insects would have a greater claim to have been its guardians? Or vegetation? Perhaps if there is a God, it's more likely that it's some sort of giant aphid? I'm telling you, giant ants could have built the Earth in seven days!

My two penneth worth, anyway.

[DP McCoy]

The name Jesus is thought to have been quite common at the time,so how do they know this is THE Jesus,maybe this is Jesus the Sandel maker or somebody.:p

[Ash's_evil_hand]

The name Jesus is thought to have been quite common at the time,so how do they know this is THE Jesus,maybe this is Jesus the Sandel maker or somebody.:p

He's not the messiah, he's a very naughty boy! :p

[DP McCoy]

He's not the messiah, he's a very naughty boy! :p

LMAO!!

"Blessed are the cheesemakers"

[Unaboner3000]

I believe in Jesus....I have to. As a Satanist, it would be hypocritcal of me to say Satan exists but Jesus is a myth.

[Unaboner3000]

omc for god in 2008

We are putting God up to a vote in '08? :p

Oh shit, I guess omcdave is as good a god as any. I will light some candles and sacrifice a chicken in your name tonight.

[Dominion]

Just some food for thought:

There is an amazingly interesting book by Acharya S entitled "The Christ Conspiracy". I believe a little bit of everything and I think that we should look at all avenues of explanation before making up our minds.


Description of book from Amazon.com:

Book Description
Controversial and explosive, The Christ Conspiracy marshals an enormous amount of startling evidence that the religion of Christianity and Jesus Christ were created by members of various secret societies, mystery schools and religions in order to unify the Roman Empire under one state religion! This powerful book maintains that these groups drew upon a multitude of myths and rituals that already existed long before the Christian era and reworked them into the story the Christian religion presents today-known to most Westerners as the Bible. Author Acharya makes the case that there was no actual person named Jesus, but that several characters were rolled into one mythic being inspired by the deities Mithras, Heracles/Hercules, Dionysus and many others of the Roman Empire. She demonstrates that the story of Jesus, as portrayed in the Gospels, is nearly identical in detail to those of the earlier savior-gods Krishna and Horus, and concludes that Jesus was certainly neither original nor unique, nor was he the divine revelation. Rather, he represents the very ancient body of knowledge derived from celestial observation and natural forces. A book that will initiate heated debate and inner struggle, it is intelligently written and referenced. The only book of its kind, it is destined for controversy.

[Posher778]

I believe in Jesus....I have to. As a Satanist, it would be hypocritcal of me to say Satan exists but Jesus is a myth.

Why would someone do that? Its not my place to judge, I know that. I'm not trying to start something, i'm just really curious as to why someone would worship the being that despises you so much that they torment you eternally...
explain?


Yes I believe in Jesus, the Christ one that is, and I believe everything in the bible about him dying on the cross and coming back from the dead.

[Roderick Usher]

Satanists & the Church of Satan are a joke. Anton Le Vey was a clown. People who follow his way are fools, but no more foolish than any other cult member. Most join because they're pissed off at the Christain world and want to be shocking. But they are poseurs. They don't kill people for sacrifice and they hold no power...they just get blamed for shit because they look guilty to most people. West Memphis 3 anyone?

There are those who follow classic pagan gods, but that's waaaaay different.

The Christian idea of "The Devil" and "Satan" are simply ways the early church demonized pagan gods (Pazuzu, Baphomet, Pan, etc) in order to spread their word. In the same manner they very succesfully co-opted pagan holidays and changed their meanings (Christmas & Easter were both huge seasonal pagan events that the church took over)

I say none of this to disavow Christ. Personally, I follow his teachings of love, acceptance and forgiveness rather closely - whether the miracles are true or not has no bearing on the fact that his way was and is revolutionary.

I merely wish to point out that the history and the bible that most take for granted has been written and rewritten over and over to suit the political and religious agendas of those in power. There is great Truth in the book, but very little fact.

[Ash's_evil_hand]

I merely wish to point out that the history and the bible that most take for granted has been written and rewritten over and over to suit the political and religious agendas of those in power. There is great Truth in the book, but very little fact.

I couldn't agree more. 2000 years of Chinese Whispers - what else can you possibly expect?

You try and convey an account of anything across so many cultures over so many generations. Even the most insignificant 'stylistic' or cultural slant on anything will eventually distort any original out of all recognition. Not to mention rewriting for current political correctness, personal agendas and a million other factors.

[bloodrayne]

I believe in Jesus....I have to. As a Satanist, it would be hypocritcal of me to say Satan exists but Jesus is a myth.Excuse me...Satanists don't believe that an actual entity considered 'Satan' really exists...Devil Worshippers believe in Satan, Satanists do not...Don't call yourself a Satanist if you don't know what it means...

[Unaboner3000]

Why would someone do that? Its not my place to judge, I know that. I'm not trying to start something, i'm just really curious as to why someone would worship the being that despises you so much that they torment you eternally...
explain?


Yes I believe in Jesus, the Christ one that is, and I believe everything in the bible about him dying on the cross and coming back from the dead.

No one is worshipping anyhting that despises them and wants to torment them eternally. Satan is more of a central symbol for many various gods including Ahriman, Loki, Set, Amon, Belial , etc... They are all seen as symbolic of the same ideals and archetype. The Church of Satan claims that every individual can be his or her own god and is responsible for his or her own destiny.

I would be happy to send you .pdf file of the Satanic Bible if you would like to read up on this subject.

[bloodrayne]

The Church of Satan claims that every individual can be his or her own god and is responsible for his or her own destiny.

This is correct...So why would you say you believe in Satan?...That doesn't make sense...

[Unaboner3000]

This is correct...So why would you say you believe in Satan?...That doesn't make sense...

To sound more controversial and get some of the Jesus-freaks (sorry Posher778) to reply. :eek:

[bloodrayne]

To sound more controversial and get some of the Jesus-freaks (sorry Posher778) to reply. :eek:Oh...Shit-stirring...I get it:rolleyes:

[crazy raplh]

TO me it seems to big for any human to actually pinpoint the exact creator. or god. I believe it is arrogance that we use to just have some sort of faith or guidance. That is all it really is. To each there own. No one is right or wrong in this matter I think. For what the brain creates is what is created in your reality. SO Do I believe in god? I can't say that I believe one power created the whole universe, or mankind. I for sure do not believe in the Adam and Eve story. I just believe that it is good to have a sence of direction. I dont go to chirch or read the bible, but from time to time we all get help somewhere.

[Dominion]

It's refreshing to see a public place where satanists and christians can get along. :p

[stubbornforgey]

'picks the lint out of her bellybutton and walks out'

[Posher778]

To sound more controversial and get some of the Jesus-freaks (sorry Posher778) to reply. :eek:

Oh, I see. You're just an asshole, ok then, that sums it up.

[Dominion]

'picks the lint out of her bellybutton and walks out'

WTF?:confused: :confused:

[stubbornforgey]

WTF?:confused: :confused:

what..??
do you want some of my lint..??
get your fucken own.!!

[Posher778]

WTF?:confused: :confused:

You are?







.......

[Dominion]

what..??
do you want some of my lint..??
get your fucken own.!!


Before I respond, how old are you?

[stubbornforgey]

Before I respond, how old are you?


old enough to pick lint out of my belly button

[Dominion]

old enough to pick lint out of my belly button
OK. Nevermind.

[Posher778]

What does my age matter? Does it change my significance? Does it make me less intelligent?

[Dominion]

What does my age matter? Does it change my significance? Does it make me less intelligent?


It doesn't matter. I wasn't asking you, I was asking StubbornForge because I thought he was giving some odd responses.:D

[stubbornforgey]

It doesn't matter. I wasn't asking you, I was asking StubbornForge because I thought he was giving some odd responses.:D

SHE!!SHE!!
look at the avatar.. :o

[Posher778]

It doesn't matter. I wasn't asking you, I was asking StubbornForge because I thought he was giving some odd responses.:D

Uh oh... you called her a he... You're fucked.

[Dominion]

Uh oh... you called her a he... You're fucked.

Oops. I guess I just naturally refer to people online as "he" unless theyhave an obviously female name...

What is a "forgey"? Should I know this?

[stubbornforgey]

Oops. I guess I just naturally refer to people online as "he" unless theyhave an obviously female name...

What is a "forgey"? Should I know this?


ok.
forge = a tool used for blacksmithing
the 'Y' was added there by my aussie friend
Stubborn was christened to me by mods and admins in another forum

put them all together and your doing the holey pokey :o

[Posher778]

The only person that you must reference as a she upon meeting the person is angra. It'll be funny;) :D

[Dominion]

The only person that you must reference as a she upon meeting the person is angra. It'll be funny;) :D

OK. I take it that angra is a male and you want me to have some fun with him then?

[Posher778]

OK. I take it that angra is a male and you want me to have some fun with him then?

mmmhmm. I thought he was a girl for nearly 2 years.

[stubbornforgey]

OK. I take it that angra is a male and you want me to have some fun with him then?


Would we fool with you??????????
Angra is all woman..
and is such a sexy one at that ..
pm her and say 'hubba hubba baby'
and she is like putty in ure hands :p

[Dominion]

Would we fool with you??????????
Angra is all woman..
and is such a sexy one at that ..
pm her and say 'hubba hubba baby'
and she is like putty in ure hands :p


Sorry. I can't envision myself ever using the phrase "hubba hubba baby" besides in the context of this post.

[bwind22]

I didn't read through all the pages of this thread. I just popped in to address the initial question posed in the subject.

I'm certain that the existence of Jesus is a historical fact. I don't think any person or religion will tell you the man did not walk the Earth. The question or debate comes in as to whether or not he was the son of God, could perform miracles, resurrected after death, etc...

So to answer this question.... Yes. I believe in Jesus. Anyone that doesn't, needs to do a little research.

[crazy raplh]

thank you bwind. This was turning into a elementry school really fast.

[bwind22]

Well, I just made the mistake of going back and reading the whole thread... Whooops. Another good thread crashes and burns, huh?

First, I'd like to thank BR for saving me a moment's typing by pointing out to the 'Satanist' that he didn't know what he was talking about. God & the Devil are Christian concepts & since The Church of Satan is not Christian, they do not believe in (or worship) either. Una, you may have just been saying that get a rize, but really all you were doing was making yourself look like you had no idea what you were talking about.

Okay, moving on... Like I said, no one (with any degree of intelligence) denies that Jesus Christ of Nazareth, the man, was at one point alive on Earth. That much is fact. The debate is whether or not he is the son of God like Christians believe, a prophet like Muslims, Jews and a few other religions believe, or simply a good man like atheists and pagans believe.

My ponderance is this though... Does it really matter which is right? In any of those 3 scenarios, we can all learn how to live a better, more moral, more wholesome life by following his examples set forth in the Bible. If you're Christian, you can benefit from following his teachings. If you are a Jew or a Muslim, you can benefit from following his teachings and if you are an atheist or pagan, you can benefit from following his teachings. Why? Because regardless of whether or not he was the son of God, he led a good life and we can all learn from that.

So my take on religion is this... Believe in God if you want, don't if you don't want, but lead a good life either way and the world will be a better place.



In regards to James Cameron's film... It can't possibly prove anything conclusive. For starters, Jesus & Mary were 2 of THE most common names in that era. Secondly, I saw that they were taking DNA samples from the tombs, but what's that gonna prove if there's no other samples of Jesus Christ's DNA to compare it to? It'll all be guesswork & speculation without the possibility of concrete scientific facts to back it up. Because of that, the believers will disavow it and continue to believe while the naysayers will claim it's proof that Christians are wrong and presto... We end up right where we started out.



Anyways, that's my take on the whole thing... I'm agnostic by the way. I don't know what's out there & I doubt I will figure it out in my lifetime so I'm content to just live my life without the answers. (I'd rather do that than spend my whole life believing in something that can't be proven or waste my time searching for answers that are not to be found.)

[stubbornforgey]

In all seriousness though..
I do believe in this topic ..more ways than one.

[slayer666]

Why must every thread be derailed with schoolyard nonsense?

From what I have read, I can accept that someone named Jesus may have lived in the location and around the time the Christian Jesus was supposed to have lived. However, I do not believe in gods, angels, devils, or any other sort of supernatural entities. If a Jesus actually lived, he was human. Much of the Jesus myth existed in the culture long before the Christian Jesus supposedly lived, and it is rather easy to find how these ancient legends were applied to him by early Christian writers interested in elevating him to divine status.

[Phalanx]

Hey I know...Jesus is that guy, right?

[ferretchucker]

This is a bit late I know but who cares. satan was gods first angel but he disagreed with god so god gave him the horrible job of ruler of hell. Satan only tries to get people to do bad things to get them down there with him instead of with god. Satanism is about (like stated earlier) praising yourself when you do good or good happens and you don't beg for forgivness for sins, you admit you did wrong and get on with life

I personally think that's a good way to go as far as religions are concerned. It annoys me when people talk about all this sacrificing goats and slicing yourself with knives shit. Just thought I'd get my say in, no matter how late I was. Also, angels hate humans because we have freewill to believe in what we want and worship what we want. They're constantly arguing with god about it and such. By coincidence, my name is Gabriel. And just for the sake of it(and because I like the name) my first born son will be called Azrael.

[bwind22]

Also, angels hate humans because we have freewill to believe in what we want and worship what we want. They're constantly arguing with god about it and such.

You gotta stop believing everything you see on tv.

[ferretchucker]

didn't see it on tele. Read it in a really old book in the gothic/magic/anything cool shop in town.

[Dante'sInferno]

I believe.My real name is Jeremiah by the way,it's from the bible if any of you have read it.

[ferretchucker]

my names bibleier

[bwind22]

didn't see it on tele. Read it in a really old book in the gothic/magic/anything cool shop in town.

Ah. Well, then... It must be true.

[novadawn969]

Ah. Well, then... It must be true.



He has a point, Kid...

[pinkerton]

You gotta stop believing everything you see on tv.



lol-That reminded me of Dogma.

[Unaboner3000]

The problem with faith in God is it requires....well, FAITH. Religious people love to sstate emphatically that GOD has to exist, but how do you know? You don't. You just take it on faith or on the word of a priest (who took it on faith or the word of another priest). I'm not saying there definitely isn't some higher power somewhere (since I can't prove THAT either), but I would like for those that believe to at least be honest....and say, that they ARE NOT 100% SURE that God and Heaven actually exist. That's all I want in these conversations. I think the overwhelming majority of the Christian community isn't all that certain of anything, but won't admit it. I just want less of the bullshit.

[ferretchucker]

I believe books. They tell me to burn things. gah hoy

[crazy raplh]

Very good ferretchucker........ Idont think it is a question of whether or not it actually exist but if you just have faith. Just like the devil a nother character. I see the devil and god as just a comic charactor. They both are not real. at least to me. I believe we are just here for this exisitence. but to learn as much as we can. about 99% of people don't reach there potential and waste away. what happens after this life I dont think there is a real answer to it. till we experience it. No Living human can answer that question.

[crazy raplh]

Well, I just made the mistake of going back and reading the whole thread... Whooops. Another good thread crashes and burns, huh?



Yea what is up with all of these kids in here lol.

[novadawn969]

Yea what is up with all of these kids in here lol.


I resent that... :eek:


Most of us are kids at heart. :p

[ferretchucker]

i sometimes believe that we go wherever we believe we'll go. If you're christian -heaven/hell, humanist- nowhere, hindu - ressurect. Like stated, it's all a matter of faith. I'll believe when there is conclusive proof nowadays. Jesus came, miracles happened and angels spoke to people. So far, none of that has happened to me and anyone close to me. It was so long ago, for all we know, the bible could hve been a story book that we misinterpretted.

[Dominion]

http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s65/pinkerton_02/bill_nye_makes_jesus_cry_more.jpg

Bill Nye is a poser.

[novadawn969]

Bill Nye???

I remeber watching that when I was like 6...

That and the one with the people with New England accents and the fat guy in a rat suit...



wow...

[Despare]

That and the one with the people with New England accents and the fat guy in a rat suit...



Beakman's World (sp?)

Remember the penguins in the beginning? What the hell was that all about? What a weird ass science show.

[crabapple]

Aw, man...Beakman's World kicked ass. I have a tape of that somewhere.

[ferretchucker]

bananas in pyjamas, arecoming down the stairs!

[Demon Seed]

bananas in pyjamas, arecoming down the stairs!
I still watch that show (I've got all the episodes) :o



I'm not kidding either




"I'm a rat, I'm a rat, I'm a clever, clever rat"

[The_Return]

I still watch that show (I've got all the episodes) :o



I'm not kidding either




"I'm a rat, I'm a rat, I'm a clever, clever rat"

I had a nightmare about being kidnapped and tortured by one of the bears from that show:(

[Demon Seed]

I had a nightmare about being kidnapped and tortured by one of the bears from that show:(It was probably Amy, she can be evil sometimes :D

You probably watched the episode where she tied B1 to a chair

[The_Return]

It was probably Amy, she can be evil sometimes :D

You probably watched the episode where she tied B1 to a chair

Actually, it was Morgan:eek:

[Posher778]

Return, only you would have a dream like that:rolleyes:

[crazy raplh]

word to that I like nightmares

[VampiricClown]

My friends, friend Jesus? I guess. Never did anything wrong to me. I'd cheer him on.

Oh, wait...You mean the biblical one.

Nope.