Serial Killers

[Nikkif8]

My big thing is serial killers. FOr some reason the phsycological aspect of what the hell makes these people do this things fascinates me, as well as forensics but... Who is your favorite serial killer, real or from a movie. Mine would be Ed Gein, most horror movies dipict what he did in some form or another.

[Vodstok]

the funny thing is, although he is typically grouped with serial killersa, by definition, Ed Gein is not one. although it often differs, the commonly accepted definition of a serial killer is 3 or more victims with a cooling down period in between killings. Gein only killed 2, he was mostly a grave robber.


The most interesting poeple to me are Edmund Kemper (who still hopes to get out someday... fat chance) and albert fish.

[urgeok]

i think serial killers are chicken shit assholes with baby dicks and abandonment issues.

i think we should ignore them because it's attention they seek.

glorifying them is pathetic.

[Nikkif8]

I don't think any of us are "glorifying" them, at least I know I am not. I am more into the the psychology aspect of figuring out what makes these people tick because all of them are from very different backgrounds, some were abused some were not, some have cemical embalances some don't, ect.

[Haunted]

You have a point, Urge. Unfortunately, what happens is the first kill attracts the police, which in turn attracts the media. Thus, the vicious cycle begins, case in point, the Washington Sniper incident a few years ago. I also recognize that you're indicating the gross (amount) quanties of books on the subject inspiring those folks with the pre-existing conditions for such behavior to embark on a rampage.

Psychiatry links their behavior to antisocial personality disorder (sociopaths/psychopaths [commonly and grievously confused with psychosis/psychotic which, in most cases, the patient is rarely if ever violent or even terribly aggressive]). So, as was stated, the more society glorifies the "serial killer" the more people with this type of behavioral problem will feel compelled to act out their desires in order seek out attention. Another problem is that antisocial pd is hard to treat because A. Diagnosis, because the patient doesn't see that they have a problem and B. There isn't really a controlled way to treat them other than just locking them up straight away.

Then the question is: Is antisocial personality disorder an actual disorder? It's in the DSM. However, the real psychiatrists of today, i.e. those that actually research medicine, the brain, and neuro-science (like my own psychiatrist- I'm fortunate, let me tell you) have isolated mental disorders into five actual measureable disorders: Clinical or Chronic Depression, BiPolar and BiPolar II Disorder, Obsessive Compulsive Disorder, Panic/Anxiety Disorder and those disorders that fall under the Schizo family (Psychosis... although psychosis itself can be a complication of any real mental disorder. These disorders can be seen on brain scans, so we now know that do, indeed, exist. (Multiple Personality Disorder is not an actual mental disorder).

I did a lot of research about my health problems...:o

[the_real_linda]

i dont think any of us idolise them, its just really interesting too delve into a person psyche who can commit these actions....why people do anything is interesting to know but extreme actions like these do push what humans are capable of

[urgeok]

i know for a fact that a lot of people DO idolize them..


maybe not the people here ... :rolleyes:

but people do. they feel they generate a sort of aura of bad ass coolness - some misguided folks respond to this.

Devil's Rejects, anyone ?

for the most part they killed people - defensless people - when they didnt expect it.

most serial killers are little insignificant worms who are looking for the least difficult way of changing the world around them. getting attention. making the news.
they couldnt conceive of doing it in a way that would actually take some positive effort.

lets face it - once you are fucked enough to make the choice that 'yeah - i can kill someone' how much skill does it take to walk up to someone unsuspecting and shoot them in the back of the head ?


and if someone is crazy enough to kill someone - i really dont care why ..

the fucker was wired wrong - send him back to the store.

[Vodstok]

I find aberrant psychology interesting, and it doesnt hurt that i am married ot someone with degrees in psychology and criminla justice...

but i refuse to give them any glory, though . i refuse to do articles on any living serial killer on my site. The funny thing is that i sdont think very many people really glorify them or look up to them, more they are curious about them like they would be a circus freak with 4 hands... plus, they are scary. the make the idea very real that the person sitting next to you could murder you and have his way with your corspe simply because he wants too. And fear is fascinating. if it wasnt, this website would not exist.


it's weird, they are real, but at the same time, they arent. they exist in the world, but most o fus will never have our lives touched by them in any way, so they are basically fictional characters with real-life counterparts, to boil them down to their parts, and that is very interesting to many of us.


However, saying that anyone admires them... thats just crazy talk :)

[slasherman]

..i like watching documentaries about them...gives me ideas...but only fiction ...

[Haunted]

I stand somewhere in with Urge and Vod's statements. It's true that most of us will never encounter a serial killer, however, for the people that do it's horribly unimaginable. No one should have to go through that.

I try really hard to be compassionate, but Urge made a good point when he said, "...send them back to the store." With antisocial personality disorder (which is the clinical problem you're dealing with here) that's pretty much all you can do other than permanent hospitalization and added to isolation from other patients, because these people cannot and/or will not acknowledge that they have a problem. Also there is no chemical problem, so medication doesn't work short of sedation.

If you look at other animal species on this planet, when they have a member of their pack, family, pride, etc, that doesn't not function in such a way that promotes survival or endangers them, they will kill that member of the group. It happens.

The hard part is figuring out the personality type/traits before one developes into a sociopath. Usually they start developing these traits in childhood, but parents miss them and the developemental problems get worse.

Instead of studying serial killers themselves, it might be more beneficial to study the psychiatry/psychology behind them. That way, we as a society divert our attention from the people and towards the problem. It's like warning systems for weather, if we see the patterns we have enough time to react with little to no casualties.

[Nikkif8]

Thanks Trip, this thread was meant to be fun in the aspect of movies and how a lot of serial killers are what makes the movies. Also I don't agree that we can just study the psychology of serial killers, we have to study THEM to get that information, none of them are hardly the same. They all vary drastically from thier backgrounds. Some did show signs as children but some didn't. This thread is supposed to be fun and more about the movies then anything.

[Haunted]

I would rather that they not be so that we don't have to study them. We can create our own monsters in our head, and they won't actually hurt anyone.

I realize that in reading this it may seem as if I'm taking an argumentative tone, and I don't mean to at all. Please don't think I'm trying to be an asshole. I'm just trying to point out that the fact that there are people out there who actually torture and kill people for their own pleasure is very disturbing. For example, what Fish did to little Grace was beyond horrible, and then he wrote her mum a detailed letter. That is so awful and hurtful.

I just think that with all the horrors in the world that we're now aware of... *shudders* I really can't even read the "True Crime" section any more. I'm cool with the fantasy, but I'm growing away from the brutal killing type films and more toward the (I hate this term) supernatural types. There's just too much of that junk in reality and... you know?

I think that's where people are coming from, and I think that in the wake of all of this violence, many people are growing more and more weary of the "real thing." ...Even some of us ol' horror buffs.

The language on the necklace is Sanskrit (took it in college as part of my BA), and the word is "ahimsa." It means, "nonviolence."

[crabapple]

Word.

[azathoth777]

Aberrant behavior is facinating, and serial killing is about as aberrant as you can get. I have many books on serial killers, and even a few on killer kids. It's interseting to see what people are capable of and what, if anything, drives them to it. How can someone be a loving husband and father, a pillar of the comunity, and go out and tear apart another human being every other week....
Could I be a victim; could I just flip one day and start doing that; could my neighbor be a serial killer, my girl/boyfriend, my father....
This, and more, is what makes them so 'popular'.
To those outside they are normal people, until there caught. They could be anyone. Someone here my be one.....

-Serial Killer Statistics -

The USA has 76% of the worlds serial killers.

Europe in second, has 17%. England has produced 28% of the European total; Germany produces 27%, and France produces 13%.

California leads in the US with the most Serial Homicide cases that have occured. Texas, New York, Illinois, and Florida follow shortly behind.
Maine has the lowest occurence of serial murders - none. Hawaii, Montana, North Dakota, Delaware, and Vermont each have had only one case of a serial murder.
84% of American killers are caucasian.

16% are black.

Men make up at least 90% of the world wide total of serial killers.

65% of victims are female.

89% of victims are white.

44% of all killers start in their twenties.

26% start in their teens.

24% start in their thirties.
Out of all the killers, 86% are heterosexual.

[urgeok]

Originally posted by azathoth777
Aberrant behavior is facinating, and serial killing is about as aberrant as you can get. I have many books on serial killers, and even a few on killer kids. It's interseting to see what people are capable of and what, if anything, drives them to it. How can someone be a loving husband and father, a pillar of the comunity, and go out and tear apart another human being every other week....
Could I be a victim; could I just flip one day and start doing that; could my neighbor be a serial killer, my girl/boyfriend, my father....
This, and more, is what makes them so 'popular'.
To those outside they are normal people, until there caught. They could be anyone. Someone here my be one.....

-Serial Killer Statistics -

The USA has 76% of the worlds serial killers.

Europe in second, has 17%. England has produced 28% of the European total; Germany produces 27%, and France produces 13%.

California leads in the US with the most Serial Homicide cases that have occured. Texas, New York, Illinois, and Florida follow shortly behind.
Maine has the lowest occurence of serial murders - none. Hawaii, Montana, North Dakota, Delaware, and Vermont each have had only one case of a serial murder.
84% of American killers are caucasian.

16% are black.

Men make up at least 90% of the world wide total of serial killers.

65% of victims are female.

89% of victims are white.

44% of all killers start in their twenties.

26% start in their teens.

24% start in their thirties.
Out of all the killers, 86% are heterosexual.


funny but i dont find it fascinating at all ..

unless you are a phsychologist or in law enforcement i cant understand the attraction to this kind of information.


i do understand being interested in things ..

some people like cars .. want to know how they work - keep stats ..

some people like aircraft - same thing.

I like movies and a ton of other stuff ...

these interests enrich peoples lives. I cant comprehend being fascinated with the minds and methods and motivations of the foulest scum on the planet.

to me i draw a comparrison with being fascinated with shit.

there is shit in the world .. we shit every day.

i'm really not interested in shit .. whats in it .. why i's brown.
how big some peoples shit is, how many times they shit.

i just wipe it off and flush it away.

i suppose that if there was a reason for me to need to know about shit (i was a Dr.) then it would be interesting to me but i'm not.
the information does nothing to enrich my life or stimulate my mind because i find shit unpleasant.

i guess i'm speaking soley for myself here but i have no interest or find no fascination with human pieces of shit. talking about them outside the police station gives most of them exactly what they wanted when they set out to destroy lives in the 1st place .. attention.

i like horror films for the goofy escapism and the attempt at thrills ..i have always preferred the supernatural films because they arent real.

i guess i've always been uncomfortable when the lines of entertainment get blurred with unpleasant reality - as exploitation films often do.
this whole serial killer thing plays into that very closely.

am i saying everyone should think like me? - nope

i'm just saying that because the thinking is so foreign to me - i i do really wonder - and question the thought process of people who are fascinated with shit.

[PR3SSUR3]

Not to start a political landslide or a debate that might cause arguing amongst the family, but I took this thread something along the lines of "what was your favorite kill in a film?" I understand that the two questions are different. But I didnt get this as a "glorifying" thread

It was for favourite serial killer, in real life or in the movies.

Personally, my fave is Ed Gein because I love the way he had sex with the bodies, and second best is Ted Bundy because he killed all those women.

But am I talking about real life or in the movies?

Fascinating.

[urgeok]

exactly !

[Spec7ral]

i get the feeling urgeok's dad was the son of sam. or maybe ed gein!

[PR3SSUR3]

Hmmm... so you're saying he might be the resulting child from Ed's intercourse with poor, dead, Mary Hogan - an act he always denied because she 'smelled too bad'?

:eek:

[psycho_butthead]

In real life I am into Ted Bundy.

In the movies I like Chuckie from Child's Play and I like Leatherface and Otis from House of 1000 Corpses.

[Nikkif8]

To me, Ted Bundy is one of the most F-ed up people, like Jefferey Dahmer in similar ways. I have seen so many docu-s on them and it baffles me every time wtf is wrong with them. Jeffery would say he would atleast try to control his urges but Ted was just screwed up and when they caught the green river killer he helped with the case and like totally got off on it.

In the Movies Freddy was always my fav cause he killed you in your dreams, and he was just hallarious and crude. The 4th one was my fav after that I thought they went down hill a bit. I think it was the 5th one they had in the theatre 3D, I saw that in theatre. ANd Freddy vs. Jason was pretty funny. Who won???? To me Freddy won cause he winked even tho Jason was carrying just his head. What do you guys think???

[Spec7ral]

nekkid came i unto this world and from it nekkid shall i go

[Vodstok]

I believe thatr peopel who are interested in the subject from an academic standpoint are actually interested in these poeple the same way a car nut may have a fascination with Maseratis, they want to know what makes this particular make of human work. I knwo that is why i am interested in them. they are scary, and i like to learn as much as i can about things that scare me. It takes away the power.

the other thing is that they typically dont kill for attention. some do, but by and large, the media frenzy is not the goal, the kill and the weird shit they do with the body afterward is the goal. it invloves sexual gratification more than anything. glory is a partial goal for some killers, but most are more than happy to never ever have anythign they are doing discovered in any form. gacy, dahmer and Ridgeway didnt want their victims to be found, which is why they hid and/or disposed of them.

On the plus side, i think it is refreshing to see some one so repulsed by their actions that they have no interest in the subject at all. If there were more people wqith that attitude, urge, a lot less of these freaks would get the satisfaction of celebrity.

And natural born killers would have been a flop.

Originally posted by urgeok
funny but i dont find it fascinating at all ..

unless you are a phsychologist or in law enforcement i cant understand the attraction to this kind of information.


i do understand being interested in things ..

some people like cars .. want to know how they work - keep stats ..

some people like aircraft - same thing.

I like movies and a ton of other stuff ...

these interests enrich peoples lives. I cant comprehend being fascinated with the minds and methods and motivations of the foulest scum on the planet.

to me i draw a comparrison with being fascinated with shit.

there is shit in the world .. we shit every day.

i'm really not interested in shit .. whats in it .. why i's brown.
how big some peoples shit is, how many times they shit.

i just wipe it off and flush it away.

i suppose that if there was a reason for me to need to know about shit (i was a Dr.) then it would be interesting to me but i'm not.
the information does nothing to enrich my life or stimulate my mind because i find shit unpleasant.

i guess i'm speaking soley for myself here but i have no interest or find no fascination with human pieces of shit. talking about them outside the police station gives most of them exactly what they wanted when they set out to destroy lives in the 1st place .. attention.

i like horror films for the goofy escapism and the attempt at thrills ..i have always preferred the supernatural films because they arent real.

i guess i've always been uncomfortable when the lines of entertainment get blurred with unpleasant reality - as exploitation films often do.
this whole serial killer thing plays into that very closely.

am i saying everyone should think like me? - nope

i'm just saying that because the thinking is so foreign to me - i i do really wonder - and question the thought process of people who are fascinated with shit.

[crippler666]

I find it interesting in the fact that no-one notices these people. They go around day to day, living a near to normal life in most cases.

Some of these people manage to convince their partner no to go to the police. Some have killed their partners.

Some manage to operate for years before being caught or before someone realises there is a pattern.

For me if they are to keep them alive then they should be studied as once they see what caused them to do what they did, then maybe they can stop others before a body count rises.

We should take an interest in this as we are surrounded by people who we don't know, even the people we do know, how well do we really know them?

[Vodstok]

Originally posted by crippler666
I find it interesting in the fact that no-one notices these people. They go around day to day, living a near to normal life in most cases.

Some of these people manage to convince their partner no to go to the police. Some have killed their partners.

Some manage to operate for years before being caught or before someone realises there is a pattern.

For me if they are to keep them alive then they should be studied as once they see what caused them to do what they did, then maybe they can stop others before a body count rises.

We should take an interest in this as we are surrounded by people who we don't know, even the people we do know, how well do we really know them? The issue here is that the typical serial killer is a chameleon. they give the appearance of normalcy and compassion usually, but it is all an act. this is part of the reason they are almost never found innocent by reason of insanity, because they know how to masquerade as "normal", and take steps to cover up their crime. They know right from wrong, at least in the framework of how they would be percieved by society at large.

i agree that they should be studied in an attempt to predict the same type of behavior in other and hopefully prevent potential serial killers from acting. The problem is, as Haunte dpointed out, that serial killers are sociopaths. there is no cure fo rwhat they have, it's not really a sickness, it's a state. it is a very part of that person's being, who they are.

In the cases where they are actually "crazy" (like herbert mullins), being a nut-job hyappens to be a side sickness, they are both psychotic AND a sociopath. Think of a sociopath as a car without a lighter built in. the outlet for the lighter isnt there, not even a removeable panel to install one later. it just doesnt exist, and can't be added later. The lighter is compassion, empathy, and anything other than completely self-serving thougts in a sociopath. the framework for such a thing does not exist.

Oddly, many sociopaths do empathize with animals. some have been animal rights activists and such, but more often, they torture and kill animals long before they move on to people. that little piece that makes you flinch when someone is hurt on tv or a movie didnt make it into the finished model.

[psycho_butthead]

Originally posted by crippler666
I find it interesting in the fact that no-one notices these people. They go around day to day, living a near to normal life in most cases.

Some of these people manage to convince their partner no to go to the police. Some have killed their partners.

Some manage to operate for years before being caught or before someone realises there is a pattern.

For me if they are to keep them alive then they should be studied as once they see what caused them to do what they did, then maybe they can stop others before a body count rises.

We should take an interest in this as we are surrounded by people who we don't know, even the people we do know, how well do we really know them? They should be studied. Cuz I want to know how the hell they get away with it for so long mwhaha for my own "reason I want to know. -laughs evily-

[Haunted]

^And what we have here is an exemplary member of society. I sincerely hope that you're young enough to make a comment like that.

[psycho_butthead]

Originally posted by Haunted
^And what we have here is an exemplary member of society. I sincerely hope that you're young enough to make a comment like that. don't worry im 15. wait never mind worry. i am the future lol mwhahaha